Thoughts on Dvorak
I paid $100 to come to Gnomedex. I paid that money to see people like Tim O'Reilly talk about emergent technology and such. I came to see Dan Gillmor talk about emergent journalism and Chris talk about RSS. I didn't come to have John C. Dvorak behave like Carrottop with powerpoint jokes and bag on a signficant part of the audience.
So, I left my front row seat, angry as all get out, and went to the hallway. I followed the old Usenet rule that states that if you're upset about this stuff, you can walk away. You don't need to put up with it.
So when John started making fun of bloggers, I got frustrated. When he began to bag on Mac users, I'd had it. I walked off. I don't need this. Not from some guy who isn't funny.
John talked about the self-absorption of bloggers, well, guess what John, just because now everyone else is doing what you have made your living doing doesn't mean they're wrong unless you're willing to admit you're full of shit. You stand up there and pretend that you're a definitive source when you're most certainly not. You represent everything that is wrong about journalism.
So, Chris, do me a favor. Don't invite him back. I understand you're very proud that you're authoring a book with him. That's fine by me, authoring a book is an honor just by itself. But if you invite people like him back, people whose vantage point isn't technical, and isn't important, will only dillute the quality of Gnomedex. Let Tim and Dan speak more. Speak more yourself. But don't invite him back.
If you do, there's a good chance I won't come back, because his talk was the biggest buzzkill of the whole weekend.
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Reflections on John C. Dvorak
Seems like quite a few people (like Tom Bridge) that are here at Gnomedex 3.0 were unhappy with John's presentation....
Alas, Gnomedex has come and gone for another year...
However, there's always next year. Suzanne and I had a lot of fun and I didn't fall asleep during the
dvorak does carrottop
Is anyone suprised that John Dvorak behaved like a complete tool at Gnomedex? I paid $100 to come to Gnomedex. I paid that money to see people like Tim O'Reilly talk about emergent technology and such. I came to see...
Comments:
How Dvorak remains gainfully employed anywhere boggles the mind.
Posted by Michael on July 26, 2003 — 7:03 PM
Talk about self-absorption! John Dvorak is the poster boy for self-absorbed journalists in the tech world. If HE didn't write it first, if HE doesn't see it your way, katy bar the door. He can be mean and biting in a way that is totally unnecessary. Which, by the way, it sounds like his speech was at Gnomedex. Chris is a good guy and will see through that crap and know it's not good for him - or Gnomedex. I'm glad, Tom, you walked out. That's making a point!
Posted by Mike Swickey on July 26, 2003 — 7:46 PM
I completely agree.
Posted by Jason on July 26, 2003 — 10:19 PM
I don't know if this is a truism, but it probably ought to be. He's gainfully employed because he has been gainfully employed for a lot longer than a lot of the rest of us. As I said elsewhere, he's been at it long enough that I don't think he really cares if he's considered relevant. He's a good read, if for no other reason than he's entertaining. Seriously, I think he's just going off and if you don't agree, fair enough. Clueless and read may not sit well, but there it is.
Posted by Bob on July 26, 2003 — 11:31 PM
Why don't you and Sammy form a little club where you can pretend all day long that Dvorak isn't right about bloggers being absorbed and that Apple is dead/dying/should be dead. I'd listen to Dvorak anyday over squeaky-boy-puberty-forgot-me Chris Pirillo.
Posted by James on July 26, 2003 — 11:41 PM
I completely agree with Bob & James. John (as have I) been making a living in the computer business longer than you've been on this earth, and something that I've learned in this time, is to not take yourself too seriously. Technology is about bettering peoples lives and we must separate the crap from the true emergent technologies that take us from stone tablets to USABLE products. John has spent MANY years doing just that, and while he has mockers, he takes a non-sensical approach to this stuff. Get over yourself.
Posted by Paul on July 27, 2003 — 12:50 AM
I'm not coming from any kind of pre-conception of Dvorak. I chuckled at the first few minutes of his talk. After a while, though, I could tell that he didn't really have anything relevant to say. His write-up said he was supposed to talk about emerging technologies. He spent about 5 minutes of his hour doing just that and none of it was anything I hadn't already read about. He intellectually treated us as uninformed end-users. None of the other presenters did this. I'm concerned that his real audience won't know when he's telling the truth and that hurts us all.
Are bloggers self-absorbed? Maybe. I remember the early Internet when it first emerged. It was pretty self-absorbed too. The technology evolved. I have use for blog technology now (after listening to Chris and Dan) in my business and this is what Pirillo is trying to say. Open your mind to the possibilities, don't get mired up in what's going on right now.
Oh, and saying we should believe and trust him because Dvorak's reported on technology longer than anyone else? That's a dangerous attitude to take! You've got him just where he wants you.
Posted by Matthew on July 27, 2003 — 2:39 AM
Assuming one knows more than others about *anything* because of the length of time they've spent on Earth or have been employed in a particular field is a bad assumption. Hell, I've read more enlightened perspectives on the state of Apple from teen writers than anything Dvorak's published.
So, let's see, Dvorak. Blogging isn't something to be taken seriously? Interesting how AOL is building blogging tools into it's software for millions of users, Google just bought Blogger, and Movable Type's creators are busting ass on the project you're looking at right now. Nah, blogging is just a big joke.
And, Apple's dying, you say? Hm... looks like they're driving the industry to me. Any intelligent tech-minded person, be they a Mac user or not, knows that Apple bends over backwards developing "usable" products, all about "bettering people's lives." Thank God Steve Jobs is responsible for my computing experience and *not* John Dvorak.
If I want non-sensical, I'll watch The Daily Show.
Posted by Michael on July 27, 2003 — 2:43 AM
The scary thing is that the speech is canned and presented as one of three topics out there right now. John was also the keynote speaker of the entire conference, top of the speakers list, etc.
http://www.dvorak.org/speech.html
He plays on what he knows the audience will be into and create feuds of passion. Mac users are known for their devotion to the platform, and their willingness to guard their way of computing : the way things should be. Rendezvous is a trend and a future product that could have been covered as a great idea. Apple’s step up into the 64-bit realm is a future products topic as well. But the guy writes for PC Magazine, not Macworld. Every cheap shot against the Mac platform provokes people to find out how they can achieve Mac coolness in their x86, Windows bound world. So the clueless guy that is handed a computer or introduced through the Wal-Marts and the Best Buys of the country to the world of computing will pick up a PC Magazine and think they are tuned in.
I would like to have heard how print media is not dead or dying. I do not read his stuff, but I was waiting to hear something that would make Dvorak keynote speaker worthy.
Posted by Niall Kennedy on July 27, 2003 — 3:48 AM
I don't think bloggers are any more self-absorbed than say.... certain technology columnists I could name. But saying that bloggers are self-absorbed completely misses the point.
When the Internet first started to become available to the average consumer, tech writers heralded it as this giant revolution: "Now everyone can have a voice!" they said. "Everyone can self-publish their perspective to the world!"
Except it didn't happen, because coding HTML pages in HTML 2.0 was a pain in the ass. Very few people had webpages, and the ones they did weren't updated that often because it was such a pain.
Now we have blogging, which makes creating and updating a web page as easy as saving a text document on your hard drive. With Blogger/Blogspot (and now TypePad), you don't even have to know the first thing about webhosting or HTML- you just have to know how to type.
So now everyone really CAN have their thoughts published for the whole world to read. And it's working- Iranian and Iraqi bloggers can tell the world what's happening in their countries without waiting for reporters to interview them. People who aren't professional journalists can join in the discussion instead of relying on the op-ed pages for debate. It's bringing the revolution that they said was supposed to happen 10 years ago.
So what if bloggers are self-absorbed? People are self-absorbed, and the blogosphere reflects real people, not just paid-to-be-pompous tech writers. And for Dvorak to miss that point shows only his own irrelevance. (Not to mention his opinions on Apple- doesn't he see the rest of the industry trying to play catch-up to the iPod and the iTunes Music Store?)
Posted by Tiff on July 27, 2003 — 8:33 AM
If blogging isn't self-absorbed or self-aggrandizing, what is it? Is it selfless? Is it a public service? Are the lives of the poor enhanced, are the sick healed, is the world a better place? Come on!
I don't want to be misunderstood...blogging is great, but keep it in perspective. You're expressing YOUR opinions (which is not truth, BTW). Dvorak reminding you of that and asking you to laugh at yourselves is brilliant. Walking out only proves his point. Lighten up.
Posted by Sean on July 27, 2003 — 9:45 PM
I think you're missing the point, Sean. Dvorak wants to make blogs irrelevant, because the idea of a blog that's effective makes HIM irrelevant. Thus he categorizes all bloggers as cat-bloggers-who-use-Macs. That's not the case at all. Look at the depth that blogs provide. Look at the nano-publishing options that Dan Gillmor talked about. Look at the "selfish tools" that Tim O'Reilly talked about.
There's a neat paradigm here. Sites like Google benefit a great deal from blogs, they get the all-important content that makes Google what it is. Dan Gillmor points out that not all blogs are trustworthy, and he's definitely right. There is a LOT of editorializing out there in the blogworld. But there's also a lot of information.
To say it's all editorials is to ignore all my entries on topics where I have distinct knowledge and experience. My entries on the speakers here, with the exception of Dvorak, are mostly transcriptions and notes, not opinion.
Thusly, I have information that is unique and worth sharing.
So Sean, do you self a favor and quit sucking at the tit of John Dvorak and start to pay attention to Gillmor and O'Reilly, you'll learn a lot more.
Posted by Tom Bridge on July 27, 2003 — 10:02 PM
I'm just glad that you didn't:
a) come back with a gun to shoot him
b) stay out there too long in case your phone rang
c) believe him when he gave you that bullshit about that being HIS presentation
Breathe bro, breeathe...
Posted by KB on July 27, 2003 — 10:30 PM
Hello
I'm a tad late to the party here... saw you in my referrers, came to look (from the Gnomeroll I'm assuming)
I'm not a Mac user so that didn't get me at all, but his bashing of bloggers did. He was ok I suppose, kind of funny, and no we shouldn't take ourselves too seriously, but I think he's missing some of the major parts of blogging. I found it funny (in that ironic sort of way) that he was saying that blogging is nothing, and then Dan Gillmor gets up and shows all the amazing things that blogging HAS accomplished.
Yeah, it might seem really dumb to talk about taking your cat to the vet. But, that's the way you get to know another person, by talking about the everyday crap of your life. That's how the community happens. That's why we care about each other and how big important things CAN be accomplished through blogs.
And now that I've written an entire post in your comments...
Posted by Sunidesus on July 28, 2003 — 4:01 AM
Never have liked Dvorak. I always felt that those who can, do. Those who can't write about it in PC Magazine.
Posted by Monkey Boy on July 28, 2003 — 4:58 PM
I guess John Dvorak has some value, but, like mosquitos I'll be damned if I can find any.
Posted by Matthew on July 29, 2003 — 12:25 AM
sounds like he misjudged his audience and gave you all the "old white men" powerpoint
Posted by xian on July 29, 2003 — 1:21 PM
I noticed you doing that. Wondered if that's what was happening. I was the guy in the Tux Polo shirt (later the LG bowling shirt at the table with you and KB).
Posted by Jeff Perry on July 29, 2003 — 1:29 PM
Your lack of appreciation for all that Mr. Dvorak has done for computing shows an incredible lack of knowledge. For instance, who gave us the first utilities to recover deleted files? Dvorak. Who gave us the original Scan Disk? Dvorak. Who gave us the template for TCP/IP? Dvorak. Who's keyboard am I using? NOT QWERTY!
Posted by supadupa on July 29, 2003 — 4:13 PM
I can't tell if that guy's being sarcastic or not.... ;)
Posted by Tiff on July 29, 2003 — 5:23 PM
Thanks, Tom, for recapping all this stuff, BTW. Nice job. As far as Dvorak goes, he's a blowhard. Personally, I thought it was HI-FUGGIN-LARIOUS that he thought Bloggers were self obsessed. Um... Hello? Kettle Black? It's the Pot calling... Geez.
Posted by Technodaddy on August 1, 2003 — 12:50 AM
I'd like to say that I enjoyed Mr. Dvorak's presentation. Not because it taught me any new ideas, or becuase it showed me a list of new technologies, but because it showed me a different perspective on some things.
Like his spiel about Bluetooth, and how that can become all enveloping. I had never thought of my gadgets allowing others to become that aware of me. (I did know that people collect such informaiton and make use of it, but it had never entered my mind to be that powerful.)
I can't vouch for his bashing Macs or blogging, but I can't say that I totally disagree with him. He chose a very small cross section...it's politics. You give an impossible list of demands and then you negotiate. I know that Dvorak doesn't hate blogs because he told me so himself, but I do know that making sure people are aware of blogs and of bad bloggers is most likely what he was going for.
Posted by Luke on August 1, 2003 — 12:59 PM